Fallen and Flawed

So if faith comes from God, am I just… not getting the signal?

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I used to be offended at this doctrine, and didn’t know how to deal with texts such as John 1:12-13, “But to all who did receive him, who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God, who were born, not of blood nor of the will of the flesh nor of the will of man, but of God.” God is good in spite of our wickedness. He regenerates us to receive him.

Hey Stoo.. I searched for a particular verse but couldn’t find it quickly, (somebody help me out) but it basically says that “whosoever will may come,” or, those willing wouldn’t be turned away. What Demian has offered here is what I’m coming to believe because the ability to come is a gift too. but I also teeter the fencepost because of the aforementioned verse and those like 2 Peter 3:9: “The Lord is not slow in keeping his promise, as some understand slowness. He is patient with you, not wanting anyone to perish, but everyone to come to repentance.” You see.. He has no desire for you to not accept his gift of faith, nor would He stand in the way of it. On the one hand God would be patient with you.. which all us beleivers are thankful for because we all somewhat feel in awe of the fact he didn’t throw up his hands at any of us. But the pride and sin in our lives gets in the way of the gifts God offers to us. The gift of repentance is one many miss out on, the gift of being able to see the err of our ways and simply get off the road we’re on and switch directions and do things differently. I think what hurts us is that we feel there’s no way we could possibly be doing anything wrong. The good deeds we accomplish, we hold those in light of others who fall short of it, and we feel we’re better off, hence we’re in the clear with God. Not the case.. we’re all filthy without the faith he gives us to clean us up. I don’t know if that answers your question or provides any insight. I was reluctant to answer you at first, but I hope this may have helped.

Thanks for the post. The longer I’ve walked with Christ the more I’ve learned that all things are from Him, through Him, and to Him. And faith is no exception!

Nonetheless, I don’t like it when my Reformed brothers make a big deal out of “regeneration before faith”. One of the commentors here seemed to assume that’s what you were saying in your post. The doctrine of “regeneration before faith” is very rational, especially if one embraces Reformed theology (which I concur with). But this is not a doctrine that Paul directly taught. “Did you receive the Spirit when you believed?” asked Paul. Kind of a lame question if reneration happens before faith.

If you read Paul only, and not reformed commentaries about Paul, you do not come away thinking that regeneration comes before faith. Possibly “simultaneous with” but not before. Certainly Paul taught that salvation is a gift of grace, and that includes faith. But he did not teach that you get the Spirit before you believe. “Did you receive the Spirit by the works of the law or by the hearing of faith?” Gal 3:2. This is typical of Paul. The Spirit’s incoming/indwelling/regeneration comes by hearing with faith.

Good question, Stoo. What j shelton said. And then the verses she requested:

Romans 10:13: For “everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”

1 John 5:1: Everyone who believes that Jesus is the Christ has been born of God, and everyone who loves the Father loves whoever has been born of him.

Dane, I’m not gunning to make a big deal out out of “regeneration before faith,” the overarching point of the post being as you pointed out–all things for Him, through Him and TO Him.

I’m hoping to nudge people towards a proper response–adoration.

Demian, top-notch post. I’ve really come to appreciate the workings of faith as a gift…and I loved this post.

Dane: to be sure, I certainly believe that faith comes by hearing. And to echo Demian, this kind of post leads me more to adoration than it does defining doctrine. Actually, my merge to reformed theology has done that. It has created utter awe in me—that God would reach into the sea of which I was dead from drowning and pull me out, revive me, and make me new. Wow, how amazing is that? So I just follow the logic, if God had to revive me, how could I have exercised the faith given to me if I had not first been made alive to exercise it? This is something I have thought long and hard about and still do. One thing I know is this: Christ died for me and loves me more than I can ever imagine!

Jonathan, I totally believe any sinner who comes to God comes because of God’s intervention… only. Forgive me if I hijacked the post. Yes, adoration and not dogmatism should be the free response of all proper theology!

Your follow up comment that “so I just follow the logic…” is what I have learned to fear in my own study and in the conclusions of others. This is often a common problem with systematic and dogmatic theology: we tend to force an interpretation on certain texts that the writers never imagined. We must be careful that we not exalt our own logic above the Logos!

When I say “regeneration comes before faith”, I am saying something that no writer of the Scripture actually said. It might be logical. It might be a reasonable conclusion to the metaphor I picked to explain some scriptural truth. But it is NOT God’s word. It is mine. And I am fallen and flawed, on my best day, and in my highest logic.

The doctrine of limited atonement is an example of this (that Christ died only for the sins of those He chooses to save). People who are dogmatic about limited atonement (or who are dogmatic about universal atonement, for that matter) have to really massage (or manipulate) certain texts that seem to teach or imply the opposite view. That there are so many “problem” texts, I believe is proof that the authors who wrote these texts were not trying to teach or emphasize a limited atonement (or universal atonement). 2 Pet 2:1 is a good example of a text that many do violence to in trying to prove limited/particular atonement. Rather than sticking to the clear intention of Peter (which has nothing to do with any theory of the atonement, but rather is a sober warning about theological deception that can creep in and subtley brings in destructive heresies…) Peter is making my point. But many miss his point to force a theory of the atonement upon Peter that he probably never even thought about.

People hijack Peter and Paul, just like I’ve hijacked Demian’s post. Okay, yes, I admit it. I’m a theif, and perhaps a poor theologian. Grace and Peace to all who call on the Lord Jesus Christ!

You can greatly exalt God in life, worship, and theology, without having to embrace extreme positions that go beyond sacred writ.

Dane: I agree with you that we can exalt God no matter of our theological dogmas, so long as we are saturated in the essentials without having to embrace extreme positions that go beyond sacred writ. In fact, we don’t even have to know how we believe, but THAT we believe. And this is the message of the Gospels: Whosoever believes. My (firm) belief in limited atonement can be explained probably different than other views. And I may even think that limited atonement is articulated very well in the Gospel writers (and the letters) and not going beyond the text, but you know what? I do think I will have much more wrong than I do have right when I enter the glory of my blessed Savior. Until then I suppose I’ll continue studying the Scriptures with the help of Him who saved me.

One way He helps His own is through the family of which He has established. Thanks for your interaction and thoughtful comments.

Demian,

Great post!

Faith, which is God’s key to see Him, is His own gift to us. How utterly mind blowing! Adoration is truly the correct response.

I’ve always been intrigued by what we then do with this gift.

Jesus chided some of His disciples for having too little of it.

He told several people they were healed because of it.

He didn’t perform miracles in his home town because they lacked it.

And I’ve always been drawn to the story of the Roman centurion, because Jesus claimed he hadn’t found anyone in all of Israel with faith that was greater.

Why the centurion’s faith was considered so great is a model for us as well. This Roman soldier simply believed Jesus could and would do what He said he would. Period. Which at times is both the simplest and hardest thing for us to do.

This push-pull dynamic between the gift of faith and our response to this gift may be in part what Paul meant by “working out our salvation with fear and trembling, for it is God who works in you to will and to act according to his good purpose.” Faith is a big part of this work taking place in each of us. At times mine grows, and at other times it wanes.

But I’m glad I know Who the Author and Finisher of it is!

Richard, I just fell in love with you . . .

Jonathan, yeah, Richard’s dreamy like that. I’m blessed to know him.

Awww, shucks, guys. I’m blushing.

I know I am late coming to the party and some of the best comments have already been made (Thanks Richard!) but I just had to weigh in. I enjoy studying the Word of God and I am thankful that the Lord has led me to this community of bloggers that I read every day. I love the wisdom that each person has to share and the Spirit in which it is shared. I thank you all for your insights and for the reminder that we don’t have to agree on the details to be led to a place of worship and adoration.

May God continue to bless each of you!

Thanks so much for your loving comment, Rob.

Great post! Thank you so much and wow, the great comments to follow!! I embrace this understanding of how we get the faith we have, from my study of the Scriptures and from the great gifted teachers now dead and also those living and sharing thru books, online material, etc. but most experiencially! My Rescue was much like Paul’s on the Damascus road. I was raised in a wonderful Christian home and my father was a very kind and gifted pastor of a Baptist church, I also went to four years of a Baptist College and majored in Bible and studied Greek for three years, but tho I had professed believe in Christ as my Savior, I was not regenerated and tho outwardly I was a “godly husband, father and church member” I was a rebel at odds with God and seeking only my own will and way and became deeply trapped in secret sin for 35 years. Then God stepped into my life and heart like a surgeon with stunning precision and perfect timing, my sin and double life was shouted from the house tops and in a moment my worst nightmare x-10,000 and the most beautiful and sweet experience of my life happened simultaneously and I felt the embrace of a sweet and perfect loving Father, who in an instant gave me eyes to see his stunning beauty and deep love for me and as I was being chained (handcuffed) he was taking the massive chains of my deep bondage to secret sin off (Being chained by the government and unchained of my bondage to sin by my sweet Father all in a moment of time!). By God’s grace I saw him for the first time with eyes of true faith and believed and my journey of true faith has been filled with delight, buckets of tears of joy and thanksgiving for the so undeserved rescue at a point when I felt myself slipping into Hell with no escape or rescue in sight!!! That happened in 2004, I am 61 today and crawl into bed each night weeping with great joy and delight and telling my sweet, sweet father, Thank you! Thank you!! At the point of my rescue I was not going toward God, He change my course and I’ll never be the same and to praise and adore him forever is my only response to his gracious act in my life!! What an awesome God we have!! Psalm 119 is now such a joyous delight to read and meditate on!!

[...] Friends: Win Something Free from Don How Faith is Created in Your Soul Daniel’s Battle with Skepticism Leaders, Don’t Be A [...]

J, I’m sure I’ve done plenty wrong. But I’m not sensing any gifts being sent my way.

tbh I’m also kind of wary of a God who creates us to be dependent on him for salvation! That makes him seem rather… needy. Or is this some inevitable consequence of free will, that any who have it will inevitably be broken.

Stoo, thanks for the cordial dialogue. The melding of God’s sovereignty (in predestination that we’re talking about here) and man’s free will will always leave you in tension between the two. If anyone thinks they’ve figured out how they work I humbly offer they are misunderstanding one of them. Yet the Bible clearly presents God as sovereign and man as responsible for his own disobedience.

Personally I would have had no idea what this post was about 5 years ago. After being shepherded and taught by my church regarding reformed theology I took an interest in it. It makes sense to me, I think it’s Biblical, and I see how it brings glory to God. Soon after finding these new words and terms to describe things (and honestly being a little proud of my new found theological knowledge) parts of life fell apart for me. I could have cared less how many points of Calvinism were correct or if the supralapsarian position(that you’re referencing when you say God created us to be dependent on Him for salvation) was correct. I needed Jesus and the comfort that faith in Him brings and he was gracious to provide it.

Theology is good and correctly applied let’s us experience God at a deeper level, but it’s not God.

Like you, in my BC days I did not sense any gifts being sent my way but at conversion it was clear as a bell. Look at Demian’s links he provided on “dead” and “blind”

Rob Walters: Yes, thank you. Christian fellowship is one of the sweetest earthly treasures we have.

“supralapsarian”

Well at least I learned a new word today!

That’s why we like him Stoo, he uses big words!

Chuck: Thanks for your testimonial, brother! God bless you and keep you in the palm of His hand!

I’ll admit, it’s a $2 show-off word.

Stoo – I wanted to say also that it’s not necessarily a bad thing to wrestle with God. Being beligerant and prideful towards Him is one thing.. respectfully questioning him is another, and I believe its a sure way of having some sweet stuff come your way later. I commend your humility evident in the way you pose questions. Praying for you.

Stoo,

What j shelton said!

Your sincerity and open heart toward God, and asking Him to reveal the truth to you will not go unanswered.

We’re all praying for you.

I don’t think I need to add anything, but just so that I can be in conversation (because fellowship is awesome!) . . . what they said!

So “how is faith created in the soul”?

“God does it.” Okay. But how?

He has chosen to do it through the “foolishness” of preaching the gospel. God creates/gives faith to those He has chosen for salvation AS THEY HEAR AND BELIEVE THE GOSPEL MESSAGE.

There is a miracle that occurs as the Word is preached, not before it is preached, but as it is preached or after it is preached.

My great-grandfather (died 1917), who became a circuit riding preacher late in his life, heard the gospel in a Methodist camp-meeting (dreaded Arminians!). But he was not converted in the meetings. He took what he had been taught and thought about it. Mulled it over. Wondered how it could be. Days later while plowing behind two mules, suddenly the revelation dawned. He was saved by what Christ did for him at the cross. He believed and his heart was indwelt by the Holy Spirit.

He came home shouting! (This is how I know the story. My grandfather’s older siblings remembered when dad came home from the field a changed man.) Faith came by hearing and hearing by the word of Christ.

Thought I’d take a different approach in answering that, with a cross-section of sorts of Scripture. I could offer up an explanation of the “fall of man” and it’s relation to salvation etc. but I thought it might be better on this occasion to show where such an idea comes from.
(Note – because the following is taken from all over the Bible and involved some paraphrasing for the sake of continuity, I’ve left out verse referencing.)

In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. God created man in his own image, male and female he created them. Now the serpent came and said to the woman, Eve, “Did God really say, ‘You must not eat from any tree in the garden’?” The woman replied to the serpent, “We may eat fruit from the trees in the garden, but God did say, ‘You must not eat fruit from the tree that is in the middle of the garden, and you must not touch it, or you will die.’ ”
“You will not surely die,” the serpent said to the woman. “For God knows that when you eat of it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing both good and evil.” The woman was convinced, she wanted the wisdom it would give her, so she took some and ate it. She also gave some to her husband, Adam, who was with her, and he ate it. At once their eyes were opened and they felt shame.

Through this disobedience, sin entered the world. Adam’s sin brought death, and death spread to everyone, for everyone sinned.
Ever since the world was created, people have seen the earth and sky—through everything God made, they can clearly see his invisible qualities—his eternal power and divine nature. So they have no excuse for not knowing God. Even those who do not have God’s written moral law, show that they know his law when they instinctively obey it, even without having heard it. They demonstrate that God’s law is written in their hearts, for their own conscience and thoughts either accuse them when they do wrong or tells them that they are doing right.
Yes, from the beginning people knew God, but they wouldn’t worship him as God or even give him thanks. Instead, they began to think up foolish ideas of what God was like and as a result their minds became dark and confused. Claiming to be wise, they instead became utter fools.
So God abandoned them to do whatever shameful things their hearts desired. As a result, they traded the truth about God for a lie. They worshiped and served the things God created instead of the Creator himself. Since they thought it foolish to acknowledge God, he abandoned them to their foolish thinking and let them do things that should never be done.

But now God has shown us a way to be made right with him. We are made right with God by placing our faith in Jesus Christ. And this is true for everyone who believes, no matter who we are.
Jesus said: I tell you the truth, those who listen to my message and believe in God who sent me have eternal life. They will never be condemned for their sins, but they have already passed from death into life. Anyone who believes in God’s Son has eternal life but anyone who doesn’t obey the Son will never experience eternal life but remains under judgment.

God, with undeserved kindness, declares that we are righteous. He did this through Christ Jesus when he freed us from the penalty for our sins. For God presented Jesus as the sacrifice for sin.
God sent his own Son in a body like the bodies we sinners have. And in that body God declared an end to sin’s control over us by giving his Son as a sacrifice for our sins. Christ died for our sins in accordance with the Scriptures, he was buried, and he was raised on the third day in accordance with the Scriptures.
People are made right with God when they believe that Jesus sacrificed his life, shedding his blood.
God will count us as righteous if we believe in Him, the one who raised Jesus our Lord from the dead. He was handed over to die because of our sins, and he was raised to life to make us right with God.

If you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. For it is by believing in your heart that you are made right with God, and it is by confessing with your mouth that you are saved.

And regarding that ’signal’:

Ask and it will be given to you; seek and you will find; knock and the door will be opened to you. For everyone who asks receives; he who seeks finds; and to him who knocks, the door will be opened.

Opps! And by answering ‘that’ I was referring to Stoo:

“tbh I’m also kind of wary of a God who creates us to be dependent on him for salvation! That makes him seem rather… needy. Or is this some inevitable consequence of free will, that any who have it will inevitably be broken.”

Okay just a few thoughts -

Was there something particular about adam and eve that caused them to disobey? Or was it inevitable that any person would have eventually?

Also the earth, sky and our consciences can all be explained without the christian god.

“Yes, from the beginning people knew God, but they wouldn’t worship him as God or even give him thanks.”

So why not design us a bit better so we don’t make such mistakes? Or again is that not reconcilable with free will?

Have never quite gotten the sacrifice bit. What does god sending some sort of avatar to die accomplish? Was it just to get our attention? Show us how awful we are?

Also lots of people seek and don’t arrive at your faith, or ask and don’t get your answer.

All that said I do appreciate the time taken to answer my questions.

Stoo,

Thanks a lot for your questions.

If you don’t mind waiting a couple more days I would love to try answer them – just need to wait until I have a spare minute (which, given my inability to be concise, is more like a few hours!).

Watch this space…

Sure, I don’t mind! I know those questions were a bit scatter-gun in approach.

Good questions, Stoo. I’ll take a stab.

1. Nope, nothing particular about those two that caused them to sin. Any person in their shoes would’ve done the same thing. That’s why they are considered our figureheads and we get the doctrine of original sin.

2. “The earth, sky and our consciences can all be explained without the Christian god.” True, in a sense. As long as you don’t explore their origins and can explain “something coming from nothing”.

3. “So why not design us a bit better so we don’t make such mistakes?” How much better? “Or again is that not reconcilable with free will?” What do you think?

4. “What does god sending some sort of avatar to die accomplish?” How much time you got? Bottom line: Christ’s death as atonement for our sins is embedded in the OT sacrificial system. Read more here: http://bible.org/article/atonement-christ

5. “Also lots of people seek and don’t arrive at your faith, or ask and don’t get your answer.” This is true. In fact, the Bible teaches God elects some to salvation, and others he doesn’t. We can’t know who these “elect” are, so my rule of thumb is to treat everyone as an elect…praying for them and pleading with them to “deny themselves, take up their cross and follow” Jesus.

Your honest questions are wonderful. But don’t forget: You can’t go on asking forever. At some point the relationship must terminate in a marriage or a breaking off.

I pray you opt for the marriage. It’s sweet, brother. Very, very sweet. And rooted in reality.

Demian, thanks!

re: 3 (and 1, similar theme), if god is omipotent can he not create a being with free will that doesn’t sin, maybe can have faith without any further input from god? etc. Or at least has a chance to be that way sometimes? Rather than every ast one being Fallen and Flawed, so to speak.

re 2: with respect I was thinking right back to origins when I wrote that. Even if philisophically you arrive at some sort of First Cause there’s a long way from there to the christian god.

Will consider what you said for 4.

As for relationships, I’m afraid I don’t have one right now. I think if I ever do find god he and I will have our own arrangement…

Stoo,

re 2: True. But it’s a start. [No pun intended.]

re 3: Isn’t that what he did with Adam and Eve? Create beings with free will who had the power to sin or not to sin? But certainly he could’ve created any number of scenarios…why this one and not that one…I don’t know. It’s how his redemptive plan is unfolding. It is what it is.

“I think if I ever do find god he and I will have our own arrangement…” That’s not the way it works, but God bless you anyway.

I thought all humans basically ended up flawed and sinful regardless of how hard they tried otherwise? But forgive me if i’ve misunderstood.

I realise Demian’s already done a good job answering here, but since I’ve written a reply (in my usual book-length style) there’s no harm in doubling up…

Hopefully it answers that last question a bit too.

“ lots of people seek and don’t arrive at your faith, or ask and don’t get your answer”

In my experience, a lot of people “ask” without really wanting the answer – they seek truth, but have already made up their minds as to what they want that truth to be.

In essence, we hear and believe what we want to – and ignore and explain away what we don’t (this often applies to ‘religious’ people too).
There are many who profess to be “open” to the possibility of God and yet are dismissive of any argument or evidence to his existence. I have known people to experience even direct miracles, but later decide there must be some other explanation – because it doesn’t fit with the way they want to view life or themselves. (Thomas Nagel describes this well: http://afterall.net/quotes/201)

If we are unwilling to change what we believe, or to deal with what the truth would mean for our lives and selves, our asking is rhetorical, and our seeking only to find what appeals, rather than what is true. Some people I know have a self-admitted “authority” problem when it comes to God – on one hand, they would like to know the truth about him, on the other, the idea of being accountable to a higher power, submitting to God’s authority, or no longer being the centre of their own lives, makes them not want to know.

“God’s light came into the world, but people loved the darkness more than the light” (John 3:19)

“Was there something particular about adam and eve that caused them to disobey? Or was it inevitable that any person would have eventually?” “So why not design us a bit better so we don’t make such mistakes? Or again is that not reconcilable with free will?”

Does freewill inevitably result in sin? Freewill definitely makes sin “possible” yes, to have truly free-agents they must have choice, and one of those choices can be to act contrary to God (and if God is completely good and the source of all good – to act apart from him is by nature sin). But I don’t think they were created to be compelled to sin, as if they had no choice.

I guess what is important is that they DID sin. Only pure philosophical speculation could say whether or not it “had” to happen.
My guess would be in a sense no – capacity doesn’t entail inevitability, but then we are left with: why then, did they disobey?
On one level that’s easy – they thought they knew better than God. They sought to be equal to him. They thought that he was holding out on them. They didn’t trust him.

Partly, this was because Satan tried to convince them of that – so there was an external cause, but internally, why did they believe him? Why did he not create them more trusting or less gullible? If anyone has any theories, feel free to interject.

But, putting that aside for the moment and just working from the premise that it did happen, I’ll attempt to answer your other question – what was the reason for the sacrifice?

To sin, is to act apart from God – against his will, his command, his plan, against what is good. But sin is not just an action, it is a way of life and a disease that corrupts everything it comes into contact with. It affects our very ability to be able to turn from sin. It separates us from God.
God is holy – set apart – and inherently opposed to sin because sin is by definition opposed to him. Our sin means that we are separated from God, and this results in death – spiritual death, eternal separation from God.

For centuries, people attempted to overcome this divide through rituals, laws, and sacrifice. They obeyed God’s law to avoid sin, attempted to “purify” themselves through rituals and rules – to set themselves apart as belonging to God, and sought forgiveness through sacrifice.
In sacrifice, an animal was offered as a “substitute” – killed in the hope that the punishment of death deserved by the one offering it would be appeased through the death of the animal. Sin was symbolically transferred to the animal, and those it was offered on behalf of were able to experience forgiveness.

God in this system had shown a way to be reconciled to him, to recognise the seriousness of sin and performs acts of repentance.

But as you can imagine, this is not the easiest remedy. People still failed to obey the law, and the rituals of cleanliness lose their meaning of spiritual purity and obedience and became no more than traditions. In Psalms, David notes in Psalm 51 that what God wants is not sacrifice but a repentance and remorse – sacrifice in itself does not bring forgiveness, it requires repentance – sorrow over sin and a change of heart and action – and often this was missing from the act. Similarly in Hosea God says “For I desire mercy, not sacrifice, and acknowledgment of God rather than burnt offerings.” – the reason for sacrifice, what it represents and achieves, was easily abandoned and turned into an arbitrary (ineffective) ritual.

Sacrifice in this system was never able to remedy the problem – disobedience to God, the underlying cause, was still overwhelmingly present and resulted in further sin, and further sacrifice. The law pointed out what “not” to do, but didn’t change people’s inclination to do it.

The separation of our nature and God’s was still there.

Part 2. – Enter Jesus.

God, came in the flesh, in the person of Jesus Christ. He became human – truly experiencing what it is to be like us, even facing the temptation to sin – and yet, he was without sin, his nature was that of God. He identified with humanity, and in doing so, chose to identify with our sin. Yet he was not sinful.
He changed our understanding of who God is and what God wants, he revealed what it is to know God – and some people where not happy with these teachings. They plotted to kill him, because they preferred their rituals and understandings to the truth that he brought.
Jesus knew this, but also knew that through this act of violence and hatred, something significant would be accomplished.
When he was crucified, God experienced death. In this human state, Jesus felt what it is to be separated from God – “Father, Father, why have you forsaken me?”
He died.
And yet, because he was without sin, death – the punishment for sin – could not hold him. He was raised to life.
He suffered the punishment of the sin of humanity – he took it upon himself, making himself our substitute – the sacrifice for sin. He chose to represent us, to represent our sin, and to endure the consequences we deserve – knowing that only he could overcome them.
When he rose again, he overcame both sin and death and rose to be reconciled to God, to be free from death.
In this, he made reconciliation to God possible. That by believing in him – through faith in what he has accomplished and promised, by repentance in the realisation of our sinfulness and the knowledge that he suffered for us – we can share in his defeat of death, in the overcoming of sin, and in reconciliation to God.
In Jesus, God was reconciling the world to himself.
If we give our lives to him – he gives us life, eternal life, life with God.
The sinful nature that could not be quenched by ritual and law is overpowered by the grace of God. If we identify with Christ, our sinful nature is crucified with him, and we are raised to life as new creations, being moulded into the image of Christ – our sinful natures being conformed to his perfect nature.

Now this is a simplistic explanation – much more can be said, including on the topic of sacrifice etc.– but hopefully this was enough of an explanation to give the ‘gist’.
In answer to your last question – Jesus death and resurrection accomplished a lot. It showed us what being truly obedient to God looks like, obedient even to death. It brought about a new way to be made right with God, to overcome our sinful tendencies and truly follow him. It showed God’s love for humanity, even in our fallen state – “You see, at just the right time, when we were still powerless, Christ died for the ungodly. Very rarely will anyone die for a righteous man, though for a good man someone might possibly dare to die. But God demonstrates his own love for us in this: While we were still sinners, Christ died for us.” Romans 5:6-8

I could go on…

holy wall of text batman

Ok thanks for that Alyssa. Just to look at the first point for now : “a lot of people… have made up their minds as to what they want that truth to be”

With respect that accusation could be levelled at anyone, by anyone. A muslim might say you’ve already made up your mind not to believe his teachings, irrespective of whether or not they’re true.

Will read the rest in a bit!

Ahahaha I know! Apologies for that…sometime I get a bit carried away. Perhaps I’d be better off writing a book rather than inflicting my ramblings on people who just want a simple response

In regards to your reply, I agree completely! It was not intended as a proof of any sort, just an observance of human nature – that not all ’seeking’ is genuine.

I live in India,born in Hindu family,was an atheist during undergard,but during my schooling I had a close attachment with Christ,i didn’t know Him exactly,nobody shared the Gospels with me,where i lived there were hardly any believers (that time for me He was a God like so many other so called hindu gods,i was a kid that time)but in college i rejected the idea of God altogether and became an atheist,what made me reject Him was over confidence on my own logical, philosophical and intellectual ability.But those same abilities
after giving intellectual high for sometime led me into despair and depression.
But when i couldn’t bear it(several failed suicide attempts) i turned back to the Jesus with whom i felt close during my school days,and He answered all my prayers and brought me out of my depression.But still I didn’t know Him,i just felt that He is the special God(i was secular then,since the religion of my country is highly secular,it accommodates some millions of gods and gurus).By His grace and plan i met a believer at my workplace,she shared the Gospel,about Christ’s
sacrifice and God’s plan for our salvation,when i heard first time it didn’t made any sense to me as i was too much blinded by worldly wisdom…how could blood of Son of God can wash away sins by just believing….i really couldn’t believe it.She also gave me the Bible telling me this is the Word of God,which also i didn’t believe.
But one thing i knew was that Jesus was there in my life cause He was the one who brought me out of my desperate situations.
So i started reading the Word of God,started going to Church with the believer friend of mine,and first time in my life i felt His presence and i cried to God out of joy and not of misery,but still i didn’t know Him.One day i was reading my Bible in my room alone and then i closed it,and then i was blank for sometime then suddenly i understood His sacrifice,why He died,How believing in Him can lead me to God and the plan of salvation.I myself did nothing to understand it,it was a sudden understanding given by Holy Spirit,that moment i was crying and was on my knees and i knew He is one and the only God.This was in sept 2009 and this year in jan i received baptism (my family is still hindu,and i am sharing the Gospel as well praying for them).
Now i understand God,and love Him more than my life and tell everyone that relationship with God
through Jesus is the most precious in this whole universe,and i have shared the Gospel with many friends but they simply can’t understand,cause for people from hindu background it is very tough
and the hindus are very proud of the secular nature of there beliefs which actually doesn’t lead them anywhere near God,then i leave everything to God and pray for them who don’t know Him.
I had questions initially but Holy Spirit is leading me wonderfully in my faith and i feel closer and closer to God everyday,in my life fruits of Holy Spirit are understanding Him and His word, feeling His love and loving Him,discerning what is pleasing to Him and what is not,peace,joy,happiness,freedom,far better understanding of my life and its purpose.