Anthony Horvath: Director of Apologetics Ministry Talks
I get the feeling that Anthony Horvath doesn’t sleep.
The guy’s got a lot going on.
For starters, he’s the director of Athanatos Christian Ministries, an organization “committed to applying the Christian world view in creative contexts that range from Christian apologetics to education to the edification of the church to literature and the arts.”
He’s also a public speaker on the pro-life circuit [for good reasons]. An author of two fiction books. The founder of a literary apologetics writing contest. And the brains behind this publishing group.
Throw in a wife and four children–and Anthony is busy. But very interesting. As you’re about to see.
1. Give me a little bio of you and your ministry.
I was raised in the Lutheran Church-Missouri Synod and had every intention of becoming a pastor when, in my first year of college, abandoned my beliefs.
When faith returned, my new passion was Christian apologetics.
I graduated with a pastoral ministry degree with a minor in the Biblical languages and then proceeded to be a religion teacher and other church work positions.
In the midst of the professional church work I continued to do apologetics. I started with AOL and then moved to forum discussions.
About five years ago circumstances conspired so that I became a ’stay at home’ dad and apologetics my ‘full time’ activity. I am a father of four, and on account of the birth of my daughter who has spina bifida, my ministry has a distinctly pro-life bend in it, too.
2. What motivated you to start Athanatos Christian Ministries?
ACM made official what had been going on all along. There are any number of duties involved in running a ministry, much of them having nothing to do with ministry at all. People don’t appreciate this fact. I think small businessmen will understand, though.
Most of the ministry activities we’re doing now were started before ACM became an official non-profit. I chose the name ‘Athanatos,’ which is Greek for ‘immortal’ or ‘not dying’ rather than ‘Sntjohnny’ (my AOL presence my ministry began with) to cast a larger vision for an apologetics ministry.
“He has set eternity in the hearts of men…” Solomon said. As Lewis said, “We have never met a mere mortal.”
I take as my starting point that everyone is longing for truth and meaning and they pursue it as naturally as they breathe. ACM seeks to facilitate that pursuit by any means possible.
3. You state on Anthanatos website that you no longer believe “the best, exclusive use of my time is to reach out and contend with atheists.” I like how you qualified that statement, but I’ve found in my own experience that engaging atheists enhances my understanding of my faith and actually better prepares me to answer challenging questions from Christians. Would you agree with that statement or disagree.
Well, I can see how this might come across as not wanting to engage with atheists but perhaps the statement should be understood by contrast to what I was doing before. My discussion forum, slightly a ghost town now used to consume all of my time.
When I say ‘my time’ I mean something on the order of 40 to 60 hours a week.
This includes the loads of reading and research that one would have to do to write intelligently. I draw heavily on this experience as I seek to equip Christians.
I definitely think that that kind of engagement is useful, because it helps us bridge the gap between what we think people’s objections will be and what they actually are.
I still contend with atheists (and others!). It just isn’t as much of my time as before. Also, as alluded to before, much more of my time is needed to management and administration of the ministry, which is a reality I’m not particularly happy about.
4. In 2006, you said that the Church was actually creating atheists. What did you mean by that? You also said that if you made that statement today, it’d hardly get noticed. What’s changed in four years?
That 2006 pronouncement was born of my realization that many, if not most, if not even all, of the atheists I was conversing with had been raised in the Church.
This goes to the other reason why I’ve shifted my time to equipping Christians over against banging heads with atheists: I deemed it might be more practical to stop Christians from falling away in the first place rather than try to win them back after they were long gone.
The really controversial part of my 2006 pronouncement, though, was that the Church itself was instrumental in breeding atheists.
Now, a certain natural cycle of doubt and questioning and a certain amount of people deciding that Christianity doesn’t have the answers is to be expected and is not problematic on its face.
The problem is that the Church is doing a poor job making sure that people are asking the right questions and then exposing them to the best answers. It’s worse than that: much Christian education actually sets people up to be clobbered when they finally started thinking through their faith.
I think Ken Ham’s Already Gone documents this very well. That book represents a survey that he personally commissioned and to his surprise they discovered that those most likely to have hardened positions against Christianity were those who had been through Sunday School, VBS, Confirmation, and the like.
Nonbelievers who were ’softer’ on Christianity hadn’t actually been through any Christian programming! While I don’t agree with Ham’s total conclusions, I think his theory on why this particular phenomena is taking place is probably correct.
Since I made that pronouncement in 2006, there have been a variety of studies that have come out showing that a high percentage of unbelievers were raised in the Church. Ken Ham I mentioned. Barna has produced numerous reports indicating something is amiss. There are others, too.
It isn’t a controversial pronouncement any more because I think generally speaking it is agreed that there is something seriously, seriously wrong in the transmission of the faith.
The remaining dispute is over what is wrong and what to do about it.
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9 Comments to Anthony Horvath: Director of Apologetics Ministry Talks
I sympathize with your problems. I am one of those Church-raised now-atheists that you mention. Mr. Horvath may very well understand my background, as I was raised in the ELCA Lutheran Church, and generations of my family before that were members of the Missouri Synod.
I think one of the biggest reasons that many people in the churches are so poorly equipped to handle doubt and retain their religious beliefs is the insularity of many churches and society in general when it comes to matters of faith.
The first time I met someone who said openly that they didn’t believe in God, I was 14….and shocked. I didn’t understand because it was never a possibility before. I had never been exposed to this point of view, and I can easily imagine how many other church-goers struggle with the newness and rawness of such doubts the first time they are exposed to them.
Why I sympathize with you on this account is because I realize that it has to be terribly difficult to prepare Christians to deal with doubt and those who have different beliefs without demonizing those dissenters as monstrous Others. Where is the fine line between thoughtless demonization and preparation for engagement?
When I try to think about Christianity, without considering my belief or lack of belief in it, I ask…what does Christianity have to offer, and how do individual churches convey this, and what effects do the differences between how churches convey this affect deconversion?
The Lutherans are traditionally very big on the concept of faith. My pastor during a Confirmation class once commented that one of his personal mentors joked that 90% of the answers during seminary classes are “faith”. I had faith…but then I also realized that the Muslims, the Jain, the Jews, the Buddhists, and the Hindus have faith, too. That is one step to deconversion right there.
What else does Christianity have? It has the concept of evil, an explanation of suffering in the world and why humans treat each other so poorly. But in philosophy, Plato and many others speak of injustice and justice, too. Scientific accounts of natural selection explain that relentless competition has provoked suffering for eons, as well. That’s another step toward deconversion.
Do individual churches realize what they are doing? They act as if Christianity has a monopoly on answering moral questions, having faith in something, and explaining suffering.
I realize, of course, that Christianity is also countless other things and also exists in countless other forms…far too many for me to list here. What I am interested in seeing is how individual Christian churches can better prepare their flock for secular society? Do you ignore society? Do you ignore doubt and questioning? Those approaches are bound to fail, because those facets of our lives will almost always eventually rise to the surface in our daily experiences.
What I desire is for Christian communities to actively, honestly, openly engage with the secular culture. What is it about Christianity, what is it about Jesus, what is it about God, that makes you tick? I believe that communities which prepare their members for an open and honest communication will be more successful over the long-term than those who protect their members by glossing over criticism or who lie to their communities about what others outside the Christian environment are really saying.
RobFebruary 5, 2010
Anthony your ministry seems very interesting. I’m looking forward to learning more about what you’re about.
Tele, I am standing up clapping for you. I wish every pastor had the same outlook regarding preparing their flock to be in but not of the world. I feel blessed to have found a church that I think does a good job at what you’re saying but I am familiar with so many more that don’t. Please don’t judge Jesus on how we’ve messed up his church.
Thanks for your comments, folks.
Tele, you are right about the ‘faith’ emphasis found among Lutherans. It is a strange irony that a denomination that is so committed to education is so indifferent, and even hostile, to apologetics- or anything that would seem to diminish ‘faith’ as they understand it. I think that this is one way that the Lutherans set people up for future unbelief. Other denominations have their own unique ways of setting people up for a beating.
AlyssaFebruary 7, 2010
Great article, and amazing response Tele.
I totally agree with this problem – those who are born into Christian families and just “grow up believing” without asking questions or being confronted with opposition can have a built-on-the-sand faith.
My experience is that some churches don’t even fully explain some of the basic areas of the Christian belief system – they either assume everyone already “gets it” or act as if the intellectual aspects are unimportant.
The “mind” element of my faith really only came about when I left the church as a teenager and “rebelled” – not to the point of unbelief, but more denial – then, when I wanted to return but didn’t know how, I started reading – a lot. I searched for explanations to the parts that didn’t make sense. I looked for answers to atheist-peers questions. A whole new world opened up. Things actually made sense!
But how easily could it have gone another way…
I go to Church to worship, to fellowship, and often to learn – but I don’t feel that the majority of Churches are doing enough to teach the “hard stuff”, to equip Christians to have a rock-solid basis for what they believe.
It’s sad.
Demian FarnworthFebruary 8, 2010
Tele: You are my new hero. [Sorry Rob.]
“…if not most, if not even all, of the atheists I was conversing with had been raised in the Church.”
Why? I think it’s because the “Christian Programming” has replaced the very essence of Christianity: love. It’s that simple.
Love was the force that sent the Son to redeem mankind. Love costs. We all know it. That is why it’s been replaced. If we’re honest, we don’t want to pay the price as defined in 1 Corinthians 13. Yet, love is what draws and sustains.
When Christians begin loving the way God loves…unconditional, with compassion and mercy…taking no thought for self, going the extra mile, poured out for others like a drink offering… that’ll preach.
Kathy
February 26, 2010
[...] too long ago, FallenandFlawed blog interviewed me about my apologetics ministry and some of my activities. As tends to happen with me, I got a [...]
February 26, 2010
[...] too long ago, FallenandFlawed blog interviewed me about my apologetics ministry and some of my activities, including this book series. As tends to [...]
Anthony’s words are the most motivating and mind calming one.
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February 5, 2010